Christian Pipe Smokers

+JMJ+

FredS wrote: 01 Nov 2024, 06:27

Wosbald wrote: 31 Oct 2024, 19:01 My supposition that Trump is a Fascist who's vowed to staff his Admin — rather than with the "Deep State moles" so critical to keeping his worst impulses in check during his first term — with loyalist hacks more adept at fomenting chaos and systemic paralysis than with public service.

By that metric, trains running on schedule, sir.

I've seen nothing in all their years of service that supports your supposition. Musk is a rich wackadoodle, but even he, along with the others seem to be their own persons, who've all proven they're willing to take heat standing for their convictions. Before they had anything to do with Trump. Hardly "loyalist hacks". I think Trump is a 'big picture' guy who'll appoint folks he thinks will generally run their departments in the direction he wants and who generally agree with him on the big things. So yeah, in that regard he'll choose loyalists just like every other president.

The issue isn't whether Musk, RFKjr, etc. "have convictions". Everyone has convictions. Big deal. There's nothing remarkable about that.

Rather, the issue is whether their convictions entail those expected of all informed, patriotic Americans: i.e. The Norms of Liberal Democracy, Civics 101, etc.

VP Mike Pence had convictions — convictions which necessitated him saying "No" to Trump when loyalty to Trump would've put him at loggerheads with his obligations as a patriotic American.

Cross reference the Pence Affair with Trump's pledge to never make the same "mistake" when staffing a 2nd term Admin, and the question of Loyalist Hacks seems a no-brainer.

I'm afraid that almost half of voters are going to choose the wrong candidate.

Wosbald wrote: 04 Nov 2024, 12:18 seems a no-brainer.

You got that part right.

Wosbald wrote: 04 Nov 2024, 12:18 +JMJ+

VP Mike Pence had convictions — convictions which necessitated him saying "No" to Trump when loyalty to Trump would've put him at loggerheads with his obligations as a patriotic American.

Cross reference the Pence Affair with Trump's pledge to never make the same "mistake" when staffing a 2nd term Admin, and the question of Loyalist Hacks seems a no-brainer.

VP Pence did the right thing. When faced with similar decisions I think those we've been discussing would also put country over loyalty to Trump. They seem to be a pragmatic bunch who've hitched their wagons to Trump because they believe they can do the most good if they were to work in his administration. Most of them were recently Democrats FFS, who've shown no inclination to fall in line with, or be Loyalist to, a political party or a single man rather than country.

+JMJ+

FredS wrote: 05 Nov 2024, 06:43

Wosbald wrote: 04 Nov 2024, 12:18 VP Mike Pence had convictions — convictions which necessitated him saying "No" to Trump when loyalty to Trump would've put him at loggerheads with his obligations as a patriotic American.

Cross reference the Pence Affair with Trump's pledge to never make the same "mistake" when staffing a 2nd term Admin, and the question of Loyalist Hacks seems a no-brainer.

VP Pence did the right thing. When faced with similar decisions I think those we've been discussing would also put country over loyalty to Trump. They seem to be a pragmatic bunch who've hitched their wagons to Trump because they believe they can do the most good if they were to work in his administration. Most of them were recently Democrats FFS, who've shown no inclination to fall in line with, or be Loyalist to, a political party or a single man rather than country.

We'd be living in a very different world had Pence made a different decision.

So, here's hoping either that you're right or that we don't hafta find out.

Wosbald wrote: 05 Nov 2024, 09:29 +JMJ+

FredS wrote: 05 Nov 2024, 06:43

Wosbald wrote: 04 Nov 2024, 12:18 VP Mike Pence had convictions — convictions which necessitated him saying "No" to Trump when loyalty to Trump would've put him at loggerheads with his obligations as a patriotic American.

Cross reference the Pence Affair with Trump's pledge to never make the same "mistake" when staffing a 2nd term Admin, and the question of Loyalist Hacks seems a no-brainer.

VP Pence did the right thing. When faced with similar decisions I think those we've been discussing would also put country over loyalty to Trump. They seem to be a pragmatic bunch who've hitched their wagons to Trump because they believe they can do the most good if they were to work in his administration. Most of them were recently Democrats FFS, who've shown no inclination to fall in line with, or be Loyalist to, a political party or a single man rather than country.

We'd be living in a very different world had Pence made a different decision.

So, here's hoping either that you're right or that we don't hafta find out.

If Pence had been able to delay the certification, worst case scenario would have been a quick repeat election day with more eyes to cut down on shenanigans.

I'm hearing that key swing states won't be counted until Wednesday morning.

We are so ready for this to be over.

There were so many yard signs I think I might have mistakenly voted for a realtor.

Well! We did it!

Donald Trump is now officially declared to be America's double-barreled middle finger to the woke left and their identity politics.
Screw their tyranny!
Screw their divisive rhetoric!
Screw their idiotic policies and idiot candidates!
Screw their efforts to mess with our kids!
======================================

Republicans regained control of the Senate, so Trump will be able to confirm the Cabinet members he wants. This Administration is going to be fun.

It will be interesting to see what the Democrats do with themselves. How will they win back the Black and Hispanic voters that they lost to MAGA optimism?

Calling Trump a racist and a Nazi clearly didn't work.

Mr. Market woke up drunk with exuberance.

Reality is giddy over this election result!